Recently we learned that some families/agencies seem to be experiencing problems with a few of the provinces insisting that families complete their Giving/Receiving ceremonies immediately upon final provincial approval (like within 7 days of notification). Apparently when the agencies inform the provinces that families need to wait on I600 approval from the Embassy, these provinces respond that if the G/R’s are delayed they may be delayed for a very long time (like months) or even cancelled altogether. This obviously puts families in a very difficult position. We emailed the embassy to ask for guidance, and the following is their response:
The US Embassy strongly advises prospective adoptive parents not to travel to Vietnam until they have received this pre-approval notice. The notice is sent directly from the U.S. Embassy to the petitioning parent via e-mail. Parents should contact the U.S. Embassy immediately if anyone, including their adoption service provider, encourages them to travel to Vietnam prior to receiving the written pre-approval. The U.S. Embassy can work together with adoption service providers, the Department of International Adoptions, and local authorities to resolve issues such as the scheduling of a Giving and Receiving Ceremony. The Embassy’s e-mail address is hanoiadoptions@state.gov
22 Responses
Is there any information on what provinces are being difficult? Are they the provinces that have been heavily questioned and investigated?
Does anyone have any more information?
Shauna, I know of two provinces by name – there may be others, I don’t know. I am not going to name any provinces because I don’t want to make things any more complicated for the families involved.
I’m sorry I don’t have more information. Our goal was not to cause a panic or raise unnecessary alarms, but to share the embassy’s response and guidance. I think it is important to know that the embassy is available to help with matters such as these – sometimes PAP’s may feel that they have nowhere to turn but the embassy can be a great and helpful resource.
Thank you so much Christina,
I understand your position. I do have faith in the Embassy being concerned and it was good to read their response. I am grateful to get some information, any information!
Many Thanks,
Shauna
To add to what Christina said, I don’t believe the provinces that are causing delays are necessarily provinces that have had issues in the past. Hope that helps.
The provinces insisted that families would have complete their Giving/Receiving ceremonies within 7 days of notification upon final provincial approval because it is written in VIETNAMESE LAWS OF INTERNATIONAL ADOPTION. Provinces are not wrong in this case.
The point is the discrepancy/ conflict of New I-600 process to VN Laws.
The Vietnamese law (Article 49) says:
“The Department of Justice shall conduct the hand-ver of the child for adoption within a period of seven days, as from the date of the Chairperson of the provincial People’s Committee signes the decision approving the adoption of such Vietnamese child, unless otherwise requested by the relevant adopter with a legitimate reason in terms of time.”
The extra time needed for US pre-approval certainly seems like a legitimate reason for an extension of time.
We adopted our son from HCMC in the fall of 2006. As we were waiting to hear from our agency when we would travel, we were surpised to received a letter from the HCMC DoJ to telling us that our application to adopt our son was approved and that we should show up in 60 days for the G&R, with an extension of up to 60 days possible for a reason beyond our control. A few days later, our agency notified us that our G&R would be in about 12 days.
I hope this helps.
The Vietnmese law says 30 days with an extension of 60 days if there is an objective reason and by sending a written request .(Article 47. Finalization of child adoption procedures)
Okay – after reading Martine’s comment, I looked again and should have looked more carefully at Art. 47 as well. The letter we received could have been based on Article 47. And there is a typo in my post – they gave us 30 days to come for the G&R, with the possibility of a 60 day extension. I apologize for any confusion I might have caused – I shouldn’t have tried to tackle the timing technicalities so early in the morning. The important point I wanted to make is that the Vietnamese law does provide for extensions of time in certain circumstances. Thank you Martine for pointing out my mistake.
Christine,
You know (and all of us know) more than a thousand of VN children adopted by American last year. This year, provinces can understand our legitimate reason and accept for an extension sometimes, they may think it is an exception. However, when it happens to all cases adopted by American, it must be not an exception, it seems VN gov. should ‘change’ their laws to ‘fit’ with new I-600 process??? So some provinces thought it was an excessive claim then they insisted with their idea of 7 days… (sigh) So frustrating!!!
About the 60days you have stated, I look up the Law and it is the period (30 days + 30 days extension) PRIOR to the local department of Justice file for Decision. We are now discussing about the G&R within 7 days AFTER the final provincial approval/ decision issued.
Angie,
In theory PAP’s should be able to file their I600 petitions while they are waiting on VN approval, so hopefully from here on out, there won’t be a 60 day delay between VN approval and I600 approval… so in a sense, these first cases really are something of an exception, I think.
Christina,
You’re right, it is IN THEORY!
Most of ASPs do not want to take the risks when allow PAP file the I-600 petition prior to/ or even in parallel with the local police clearance and DIA ‘passing through’ for your child dossier. It is the FACT. So it will be a delay between VN and I-600 approval in almost cases, the point is long or short delay…
Angie,
The agency we used (Holt) is having families file their I600 as soon as they have all the necessary paperwork and I know of at least one family that already has I600 clearance well before they have VN clearance. (and in fact we filed our I600 in the US a good couple of months before we got VN approval back in the summer of ’06… slightly different process then, but the same paperwork). So clearly it can be done and it’s the ASP’s job to figure out how to do it.
I second what Christina said. We also used Holt, and even in late 2006, Holt was having families file the I600s with their local USCIS offices (except, I believe, for Illinois, which refused to process them ) well before travel approval. If Holt can figure out how to do it, the rest of the ASPs can figure out how to do it.
Gretchen
I love Holt very much (however… cause some reasons I used another agency). No matter how your ASP figures out, the most important for filing I-600 petition is all necessary paperworks be ready. I guess Holt’s families -who had I-600 clearance before VN approval- adopted older children who had passed the investigation done by local police, right? Although local police clearance letter is not required to show up, their investigations of your child origin are important step to make sure, for VN sides, the ethical of your adoption. Please ask your ASP before your filing, unless you want to take a risk.
This situation is so frustrating(to say the least). To have the provicial officials invite you for your G&R, which makes the child yours under Vietnamese law, and then say that they will not grant an extension and may even cancel it if you are not there, when they know that you cannot bring the child back to the US if they don’t have VISA approval. Then for the embassy to say not to travel without I-600 approval….
I honestly don’t understand what families are supposed to do…..
Not travel, and risk losing their child, or risk waiting even months longer?
Does anyone know what the issues here are? Are there underlying issues that can be discussed or clarified? Why wouldn’t the governments be working together on this? Is the Embassy working with families who are in this situation? Do they understand the urgency?
I have no opinion, I am honestly wondering what the best course of action is, and thinking alot about what I would do in that situation.
I’m confused as to how this would affect families who have received the second I600 approval. Does this mean that families would have less than seven days to get themselves to Vietnam? So the travel “call” is now coming with hardly any notice at all?
Well I know serveral families that are now on or past the 60 day mark with no word.
Heather,
Do you know if these families have contacted the HCMC adoption unit or the embassy to get an explanation?
many thanks,
Shauna
I hope (from the statement provided from the Embassy) that they are aware of which provinces this is a problem in and are contacting them to try to reach a resolution to this problem. Although I agree with the new I600 procedure and I think it would be nice for the Vietnamese provinces to recognize that this is a problem for the families and they are stuck in a difficult position and are willing to negotiate a solution. But saying all of that, it is our Embassy that enacted the new procedure (most likely without consulting the DIA or provinces first) and now that there is a conflict it’s the Embassy that should be the one to correct this problem. Many of the orphanage directors (from what I have heard) and the DIA are upset with the way all of this has been handled in the first place, I can’t imagine they are really receptive to changing their procedures and laws when they have not exactly been treated with respect or dignity (IMO) through all of this. I am sure this is their way of showing that we are guests in their country and we should be following their rules. The unfortunate part of all of this is it’s the families (and babies) that are caught in the middle of this particular battle.
Tracy
I was wondering you take on Tad (From Adoption Buzz)
moving to Vietnam for a year !
http://www.adoptionbuzz.org/
He has a video post posted. I really find his info very helpful.
Heather, I’m not sure what you mean by our “take”? He’s an agency employee, they have a program in Vietnam, it sounds like his job has moved him to Vietnam. We don’t comment on what other agencies do with their staff, why would we comment on what Orphans Overseas does?
Personally, I think it’s great when any agency shares insights from Vietnam – cultural or related to their adoption program.
Christina –
After reading his blog for over a year now I find he gives facts not opinions. It also seems like he meets with Vietnam officials …..he just seems like a get resource. He also has said many times over that his blog is not a reflection of the agency he works for.
I have also never read anything he has written to try to “promote” the agency he works for.
I was just wondering your take on him and his commitment to the Vietnam program. I think it is wonderful and I know his readers would agree. He has been very helpful.